Bryn Du Advisory Committee II/Minutes
August 27, 2003 7:00 p.m.
Kim Miles, Candi Moore, Jurgen Pape, Tim Riffle, Lyn Robertson, Pam Satterfield, Bill Moore, Bill York, Nancy Recchie, Molly Roberts, Bob Loversidge, Mary Ann Malcuit, Jim Siegle, Janet Gordon, Trudy Knox, Jackie O’Keefe, Tim Tyler
Pam Satterfield updated the committee on the progress made in contacting various organizations and foundations for financial assistance. Ms. Satterfield stated that she spent much time in learning the process of accepting/receiving funds. She stated that most likely a 5013C fund would need to be set up, and this could take some time. Moreover, Ms. Satterfield has spoken with people at the Granville Foundation as well as the Licking County Foundation. She went on to say that a letter requesting money could be sent to the Licking County Foundation Board by September 4th of this year. She said that she (and other members of the sub-committee) did not feel that they are ready to make such a request at this time. Ms. Satterfield also stated that a mission statement needs to be created. She found that money requests generally range from $2,000-$5,000 and some organizations will match donation amounts. Most money is given after it has already been spent. Ms. Satterfield stated that perhaps a professional grant writer would be needed and this could be expensive. Ms. Satterfield also stated that an expense account for various things would be helpful. Molly Roberts stated that any copies can be made at the village offices to help off-set costs.
It was stated that Nancy Recchie is researching available money from state funds.
Bob Loversidge stated that two areas need to be looked at when requesting
financial assistance. One, is the need to know what you are asking for, and the second is knowing what entity will receive the funds. Example: 5013C
Lyn Robertson asked if the Ohio Arts Council was on the contact list. Ms. Satterfield said yes. The following is a list of contacts Ms. Satterfield has compiled thus far:
Community Foundation, Inc.
Gilbert Reese Family
Richard I and Arlenee Landers
Licking County Foundation
Mauger, Cecil Charitable Trust
Olaf S. Wessel Trust
William B. Pollock
Reinberger Foundation – Mount Carmel Hospital
J. William and Mary H. Straker
Thomas J. Evan
Ohio Arts Council
Granville Foundation, Doug Plunkett
National Trust for Historic Preservation
Trudy Knox spoke in regards to a request for land for senior housing. She stated that two organizations have come forward offering to build and fund housing for moderate income. NCR (National Church Residences) and Lutheran Housing are two organizations that develop assisted living and independent living accommodations. She stated that these organizations build in phases, and the first phase could be approximately 30-35 apartments. A dining area and recreation area would also be needed. Ms. Knox went on to say that 171 families live at poverty level in Granville Township.
Lyn Robertson wished to add to Ms. Knox comments. She stated that the idea of NCR and Lutheran housing is to “fill in where Kendall leaves off.” The targeted income level is up to $50,000/yr. Ms. Robertson stated that the developers have researched the need in the area. She stated that NCR would need a proposal by May or June of next year. It was also stated that a senior center at Bryn Du could be helpful because some of the existing buildings could be utilized. Ms. Recchie stated that perhaps developers could redo one of the existing buildings instead of building a new one. Lyn Robertson stated that at some time (if this committee is in support) she would like to ask council to put out a request for proposal from the two groups, and this would not cost anything. Kim Miles asked what the minimum acreage requirement was. Ms. Robertson stated that she and Tom Mitchell saw two places that could possibly be used. One was behind the mansion and carriage houses. The other is further to the west beyond the stable. It was stated that the senior housing would use the same access/entrance point already in place. Candi Moore stated that NCR would do a market study of what the community would support and this could be used to help determine the size and costs associated with such a development. Bob Loversidge stated that he would be reluctant to see such a request go to village council at this time. Bill York stated that he was opposed to putting any buildings in the grass area. Ms. Robertson stated that that was never thought of. Mr. York also stated that he would be opposed to any types of proposals going to village council at this time. Lyn Robertson stated that she was not wanting to take this to council tomorrow, but wanted to include it in the thinking stages now with tonight being the first introduction.
Tim Tyler wished to address the council in regards to him organizing an annual bike race at Bryn Du. The first one would be on Saturday, November 15th, 2003. He stated that the type of cycling he would like to have is referred to as “cycle cross.” Mr. Tyler described the race as cyclists dismounting bikes and carrying them. He stated that this type of race is generally done in the winter time and has become very popular. Mr. Tyler proposed a theme of ‘old high school glory days.’ He would also like to incorporate a cross country run on the same day. He went on to say that the local high school does not ever get to have home cross country meets because they do not have a course. Mr. Tyler stated that he has had similar events to the one proposed in Galena and Spring Valley Park. Mr. Tyler estimates a couple hundred runners and maybe 100 cyclists participating. He stated that the organization he works through is a 5013C T.A.C.O and they have been in existence for fourteen years. Mr. Tyler stated that he holds approximately 45 events per year. He also stated that he would be sensitive to the property and its terrain. He did emphasize the fact that there would be a trail made by the race, but he believes it will grow over in time. Mr. Tyler did not believe he would need to use the large grassy area in front of the mansion, but he would like to use the back hillside for the race. He would not be using the woods at all. Mr. Tyler anticipates having kids races, and perhaps some vendors. He went on to say that he provides his own insurance and this race would be handled very similarly to the one held in the village this past July. Mr. Tyler stated that he would provide needed portable restrooms on the day of the race, as well as bike patrol if need be. He also stated that he could add a surcharge to the registration fee which could be given to the committee/village for use of the facility.
The general consensus of the committee was to allow any possible exposure to the property, and that this was a great idea. Nancy Recchie stated that if funds (surcharge) were raised, this would set a precedence. Bill York stated that he would work with Tim Tyler on the proposal to village council. A motion by Mr. York was made to allow Mr. Tyler to use the property, seconded by Bill Moore. Mr. Tyler stated that he would attend the September 3rd village council meeting to seek final approval.
Candi Moore reminded the committee and Mr. Tyler that the township trustees should also be consulted since they do own part of the property at Bryn Du.
Molly Roberts stated that on average 2-3 requests come in per week for use of the property and facilities at Bryn Du. Some requests include soccer by the Recreation Commission, a house tour for school funding, and selling snacks during the polo matches. Bill York stated that he could draft up some general guidelines for usage of the Bryn Du facility as it currently is to help village officials decide on what to allow and not to allow. He went on to say that he would send these guidelines to committee members for their input.
Nancy Recchie spoke in regards to the surveys. Approximately 266 were received. 163 forms were collected, 34 surveys came from the newspaper, and 69 were filled out on the web-site. Ms. Recchie stated that the surveys themselves are available in the village offices for anyone to look at. She went on to say that the numbers were very high on holding community type events in the grassy area out front – such as polo. Bob Loversidge stated that the survey was not meant to be used as a feasibility study.
Bob Loversidge spoke on possible scenarios for development of the site. He had several topography maps available depicting different uses. Each plan included keeping the open grassy area as is. The first plan called for keeping the house like a house – entertaining, special events, weddings, retreats, etc. Mr. Loversidge stated that this plan would allow for activity to occur in the mansion during the week – perhaps leased private offices in the upstairs. Mr. Loversidge stated that he envisioned food being brought in for special events and not having a full kitchen. He also stated that he had been in contact with some local restaurants on their interest in catering at the mansion for such events. Mr. Loversidge stated that this plan would call for not having a single tennis court and perhaps a full service fitness center. He stated that some renovation is required, but the shell is there. He also stated the possibility of outdoor basketball courts. Bill York mentioned an interest in roller hockey and believed the youth hockey league would be open to funding it. Mr. Loversidge went on to say that there would be adequate room to expand the pool, and that this area really needed additional thought. He also stated that perhaps one building could be used for a senior center and one as a possible restaurant. Mr. Loversidge mentioned the possibility of an art gallery in the existing barn. Jurgen Pape mentioned the barn also being used to board horses and wondered if the equestrian group/polo group would be interested. Mr. Pape stated that the barn is already set up for such usage. Mr. Loversidge stated that outdoor performances could be held in the northern end of the site. Lastly, Mr. Loversidge stated the possibility of restoring gardens at Bryn Du. He stated that he had spoken with the local Garden Club and they seemed excited about this possibility. Mr. Loversidge reinterated the fact that he sees this as a long term plan and he foresees the property becoming fully developed over time.
Mr. Loversidge stated that he did not foresee traffic and congestion as a huge problem if the existing parking was fixed up.
There was some debate as to whether or not there is a second easement in the rear of the property. Jurgen Pape believed that there was because a prior committee had requested it. Joe Hickman stated that there are easements, but he was not sure if they were only meant as utility easements.
Mr. Loversidge went on to explain what he referred to as the “other extreme.” He stated that another scenario might be to have the village retain the land and sell of the remaining property with conveyances that control the development. Mr. Loversidge stated that the window of opportunity for this option could be anytime.
Mr. Loversidge stated a third scenario and referred to it as the “Commercial Plan.” He stated that the open space would be left as is, and the village would retain ownership of the entire property, but lease the house, buildings, and land parcels. Mr. Loversidge stated that all buildings are in relatively good shape with good roofs. Bill York asked the square footage of the mansion. Nancy Recchie stated that it is approximately 13,000 square foot. It was mentioned that the village would most likely need to retain someone to manage the facility, and a lease management company could be easily contracted if need be.
Mary Ann Malcuit stated that it might be possible to have a volunteer board oversee the administration. Nancy Recchie stated that this could be a possibility, but the general consensus is that someone would need to be staffed to provide oversight. Ms. Malcuit also asked how one would go about choosing who can use certain buildings. Mr. Loversidge stated that guidelines would certainly need to be set up. Molly Roberts stated that a tax exempt bond is currently financing the property and there are some restrictions that apply. She stated that a bond expert would be available to speak with the committee to provide any needed information. Ms. Recchie asked to have a meeting with the individual and it could be determined at a later time if it would be helpful for him to address the entire committee. It was stated that 1.5 million is owed and the note is a one year note. Bill York stated that by just having two tenants leasing the facility at this time it could cover the cost of the note.
Candi Moore stated that the green space levy does not allow for anything that would add considerable improvement to the site.
Jurgen Pape stated that the options presented with the least amount of changes appeal to him.
Bob Loversidge stated that he is apprehensive to any dramatic changes, and wondered how the committee felt about the resulting changes that would occur if the senior housing proposal went through (NCR, Lutheran Housing). Bill York stated that if the developers were willing to pay money for many of the wanted changes the committee would like to see, he would be in favor. However, if the developers just want the land donated he would be opposed. Mary Malcuit mentioned that Spring Valley might be a good option for senior housing (NCR). Jim Siegle stated that he did not agree with the NCR findings that transportation for seniors is non-existent in Granville. Tim Riffle stated that senior housing at a moderate cost is a great idea, but is this property the ideal spot. Bill Moore stated that no one is opposed to senior citizen uses for the property. Jurgen Pape stated that he is in support of the senior housing idea, but not yet convinced that the Bryn Du site is the best place for it. Bob Loversidge stated that the proposed terrain for the senior housing may not be the best and not big enough.
Mr. Loversidge asked each member of the committee (and visitors) to convey their thoughts on the property.
Tim Riffle stated that if the proposed changes cost too much he believes the property should be sold with conveyances. If affordable, he would love to see the property used for recreational type activities for the community. He also envisions the mansion being used for multi-purpose uses such as parties, offices, special events. Mr. Riffle would like to see the gardens redone and the barn used. He sees the facility having mixed uses and the use being in incremental stages.
Candi Moore stated that she envisions multi-uses of the property. She sees a community center type facility with art and recreation. She also envisions a partnership with other organizations to help pay for the associated costs. Ms. Moore stated that she would like to see Denison lease space for artwork. Furthermore, she sees the mansion as the show piece/center piece. Ms. Moore went on to say that the town relies on out of town visitors and she would rather see tourism than more housing developments. She ended by saying to think long term and don’t think too small – the property is a great asset to the community.
Joe Hickman stated that he sees the mansion as the center piece. He envisions a plan done in increments. He also conveyed a need for village officials to have guidance/policies in place for the day to day operations/requests for the property. Mr. Hickman stated that he currently has some concerns with the pool and is considering filling it.
Janet Gordon stated that she has lived in Granville all her life and she remembers playing on property as a child. She would like to see kids once again using the property in some fashion and she stated she was in agreement with many of the previous comments.
Kim Miles stated that it is important to let people use the facility. She also stated that if events are held at the mansion a kitchen type area is certainly needed.
Mary Ann Malcuit also stated that a kitchenette is needed in the mansion. She went on to say that additional bathrooms were required. Ms. Malcuit is in favor of keeping the property as is and certainly keeping the green space. She ended by saying she agreed with many of the previous comments.
Bill Moore stated that he too agreed with the prior comments. He enjoys watching polo on the grounds and envisions renting out the mansion. He also stated that he would like to see horses in the barn.
Jurgen Pape stated that he too would like to see horses in the barn. He envisions very little change in the mansion, but perhaps private use in the upstairs. He stated that it is too premature for making any other definite decisions on the other buildings at this time.
Jim Siegle stated that he envisions a phased approach. Mr. Siegle sees the mansion as the keystone to the entire property. Mr. Siegle does not believe the main floor will rent/lease well without a kitchen facility. He also stated that he is hesitant of any new constructions because that would detract from the overall aesthetics of the entire estate.
Jackie O’Keefe stated that the vision for the property needs to be out there. She stated that the mission needs articulated and this will sell itself. Ms. O’Keefe stated that senior citizen housing would have a tremendous impact.
Bill York stated that he has always envisioned a “city park.” He stated that he decided to join the committee because he feels money is at times frivolously spent.
Joe Hickman stated that a request for the Tour of Homes came in from the school. The date would be October 4, 2003. He stated that a decision needed to be made because tickets needed to be printed soon. Bill York made a motion to allow the school to use the mansion on October 4 of this year. Bill Moore seconded. No one opposed the usage of the facility by the school and the general consensus of the committee was that the more uses – the more interest.
The next meeting was set for Thursday, September 18 @ 7:00 p.m.
A public meeting was tentatively set for October 12, 2003 at the Bryn Du property.
Mary Ann Malcuit asked if people could be given the results of the survey. Nancy Recchie stated that some type of synopsis could be provided.